Monday, January 01, 2007

In and Out for Hoaxland 2007

Out: Mike Nifong, District Attorney
In: Mike Nifong, Defendant

Out: "He must have somethng."
In: "He must have hid something."

Out: "He's so confident."
In: "He's so culpable"

Out: Brodhead shunning Families
In: Families shunning Brodhead

Out: Sistah Survivor
In: Surviving the Fallout

Out: NCNAACP website Hoax diatribe
In: NCCDA, "Nifong, step aside!"

Out: Brian Meehan
In: Ruth Sheehan

Out: Melanie Sill
In: John in Carolina

Out: Current Snooze Room Editor Bob Ashley
In: Former Herald Sun Editor Bob Wilson

Out: Gottlieb's Notes
In: KC Johnsons' Book

Out: Encouraging Potbangers
In: Exposing Potbangers

Out: Gang of 88 "Listening" ad
In: Gang of 88 looking bad

Out: Karla Holloway's screeds
In: Tony Soprano's videos

Out: Talking Heads
In: Reading Blogs

Out: No wrong answer lineups
In: Potential prosecutor lock-ups

Out: Minister of Justice with an enemies list
In: Minister of Injustice on everyone's enemy list

Out: Escort service drivers
In: Mr. Elmostafa's taxi

Out: Kerry Sutton
In: Michael Cornacchia

Out: Professor Joyner
In: Professor Coleman

Out: Nifong at the Bar
In: Nifong behind bars

Out: Bald Guys bullying fry cooks
In: Bald Guys begging plea deals

Out: Criminal charges
In: Civil suits

Out: Victoria Peterson
In: Rep. Walter Jones

Out: Duff Wilson
In: David Barstow

Out: Linwood Wilson's investigations
In: Federal Bureau of Investigation

Out: Wolves in Blazers and Khakis
In: Dirty DAs in handcuffs

Out: Washington Post's Lynne Duke and Andrew Cohen
In: Washington Post, "Drop the charges!"

Out: NY Times pushing Nifong's lies
In: Joe Neff's Pulitizer prize


Victim in Massachusetts said...

Another great look at the cace. I only have two words for this one


Anonymous said...

We must all remember- Crystal Mangum needs to pay the consequences too for her part of this crime. It seemsshe has gotten off the hook one time to many.Let her suffer just as the Duke families have!

Anonymous said...

You forgot:

Out: Duke Lacrosse stripper party
In: Duke 3 indictments for First Degree Rape- Sexual Assault- Kidnapping....Oops

Anonymous said...

GREAT ins and outs!

Anonymous- don't think Crystal CAN suffer like the Duke families have- she seems to be a classic example of repeating the same actions and expecting different results. However, I hope she will be punished to the full extent of the law. I once, months ago, floated the idea that she could recant and blame Nifong- that she could still play "the victim." I was clear, even then, that she's no victim. I was just hoping that "playing the victim of the D.A." would appeal to her and give her a reason to recant- she didn't. I believe that she had financial gain as her ultimate motive and deserves to be prosecuted. She also deserves to have her financial records examined- both regarding any Pell grants and any Social Security benefits paid out to her- and the Durham Child Protective Services should examine her fitness as a parent. Time for the gloves to come off!
Texas Mom

Anonymous said...


Anonymous said...

who is the dizzy person that writes these articles? please get yourself a life.

Victim in Massachusetts said...

OUT: Nifong and the DPD

IN: The DOJ and FBI

Anonymous said...

Out:Dreams of convicting three innocent boys

Out: Buchanan St.
In: Wonderful jobs on Wall St.

Anonymous said...

In: Ruth Sheehan.....surely you jest.
She just wrote, " I cringe just typing the words",in reference to the Accuser being unsure whether a penis was involved. You'd recoil in horror, too, if your entire belief system of pre-conceived prejudices was exposed as fatally flawed.
Sheehan also wrote," It is not my job to wait for cases to be resolved....". What chutzpah, what arrogance. And TRuthless says the Duke players are privileged? Sheehan really believes that she , as a member of the press, is not subject to the usual rules and penalties that attach to the slander and libel of people who have the constitutional right to be presumed innocent.
And finally, Sheehan, trying to have it both ways, i.e., keeping the faith with the gaggle of 88 and the NC NAACP, concludes,
"...we may never know what happened..."
But we do know what did NOT happen, TRuthless. There was no rape, no sexual assault, no kidnapping. Liestoppers, Sheehan is one of the most despicable players in this tragedy. Don't go wobbly on us now.

Anonymous said...

Out: Rape charges dropped
In: Sexual Assault and Kidnapping
charges is still lingering over their heads! ugh...can you say prison cell

Anonymous said...

Sheehan is OUT. The only question remaining about this dangerous person is how many of Dante's circles of hell she'll be forced to inhabit. Can't wait to start counting.

Anonymous said...

Sheehan said she would not apologize for her vicious "we know you know" column. She is not IN!!

Anonymous said...

Out: DA's office
In: Jail

Anonymous said...

I just don't understand how you and KC give the N&O such kudos. They, almost single-handedly, poisoned the atmosphere that made it possible for the rush to judgement back last march. I, for one, can't forgive Sheehan, Sill, Saunders, et. al.

Anonymous said...

FYI: Bob Wilson was editorial page editor of THS, not editor.

Anonymous said...

Actually, it was The Herald-Sun that did the first reporting skeptical of the claims. They broke the info about the fake 911 calls. That was the old Herald-Sun instinct kicking in. Then the new folks, Ashley and others, who put an end to that. I can't imagine how many old Herald-Sun hands are sickened by the paper's new direction but can't say anything for fear of losing their jobs.

Anonymous said...

Out-Dancing on poles
In-Dancing on Bars

Out-"Why would they need laywers?"
In-"Why am I a lawyer?"

Out-30 minute rape
In-No rape


Out-"Get a conscience, not a lawyer"
In-"Get a Conscience, not a liar"

Anonymous said...

Love it. Just with you could have found an in for Ed Bradley's 60 Minute segment.

Anonymous said...


And I just love 2:00's

OUT: Dancing on poles
IN: Dancing on bars


joan foster said...

Even as reflected here, there are varied opinions among the Liestopper Team on Ruth Sheehan and her posting today. I'll explain mine.

I first started commenting on this case at Ruth's blog and the N&O Editor's blog in absolute fury and disgust at the their appalling"coverage. My first long post was "Stages of Parenting" linked here at LS . Another love note of mine is here:

Comment from: joan foster [Visitor]
06/17/06 at 13:15
Ruth, your columns often presume some form of moral authority, some well-honed wisdom of what is right and it Walmart or awarding scholarships. We are now getting some insight into your own morality, your own standard of values.

Your children will learn when they grow older what the community knows now. That after placing yourself front and center of the witch-hunt, you slink in silence to the back of the mob now. Righteous and raucous, your voice at the beginning of this debacle was one of the loudest. "You're a dead man walking" is shouted to other mothers' sons, ...based in part on your powerful words.

"We know you know."

Any decent person would step forward now and DIDN'T KNOW ANYTHING. But you hide behind fluff and nonsense, cowering behind one "cutsey" column after the next. Go read that powerful, classic play "All my Sons" to see the only anti-hero to compare with yourself.. "Yes, in a way ",that man says "they were all my sons. " Colin, Reade and Dave."

I don't believe I've been "soft" on Ruth or the N&O.

Yet, apologies of any sort are in short supply in this tragedy.Ms. Sheehan might have written nothing at all or gone silent and sullen , like so many others have.I understand some of the feelings here, but when even one of these folks take a step toward us, I feel we need to take a step too.

We acknowledged Professor Crowley when he retracted his op-ed piece and acknowledge the spirit of Ruth's post today.

Anonymous said...

I've been following this since the beginning, but I think I learned something new - the DHS was under a different editor at the very beginning of this travesty?

bill anderson said...

OUT: The NAACP as an organization that stood against prosecutorial misconduct and false criminal charges.

IN; The NAACP as an organization that is trying to outdo the State of Alabama when it prosecuted the Scottsboro Boys case.

Anonymous said...

no, Ashley's been at the helm through the whole journey

justice58 said...

Bill Anderson

The NAACP is a VERY worthy organization that will stand forever. The NAACP will work to defend injustice anywhere.The NAACP is here to fight the cause of the little man who can't fight for himself. OOOOOOOh...but that is so wrong in your eyes!!!! The NAACP is defending the victim's right to be heard. Men mightier than you have tried to shake the foundation of the NAACP and failed. It is your own fear that paralyze you. Your crappy writings on a blog is NOT changing anything. But, if you think so.. dream on.. it's a free country last time I checked. Just in case you're pretending the victim is NOT part of the human race or you feel she has no rights...think again! The victim & all poor people have a Constitutional right in this country. Having a lot of money does NOT impress me. There are some people who refuse to sell their soul for a dollar.

The NAACP is serving as a watch dog for this case...Making sure the victim is teated fairly. She hasn't. That was the reason for the gag order issued by Judge Titus. It wasn't soon enough.

No one is above the law.

Do something about the weakness & insecurities you feel? It might do you good.

Your want to influence the Judicial System in NC and I don't think the people will allow you to do so. But, nice try though, you've failed...again!

If it makes you foam at the mouth that "I"- "We" support the victim...So be it!

Anonymous said...


You are crazy if you think the NAACP is involved in this case solely for the accuser. They are involved to get face time in the public---but even they have cooled off their support because the charges fell through.

in your words..."keep dreaming" though.

And you're right, no one is above the law-that's why nifong is going to jail soon.

justice58 said...


"---but even they have cooled off their support because the charges fell through".

I beg to differ!!! There are 2 charges still pending. The Sexual Assault & Kidnapping charges that carry long prison sentences.

But, I see you're in absolute dreamland. Take a reality check 6:03 you need one.

Anonymous said...

Justice-the fact that the woman suddenly couldnt "remember" if she was raped was a rdflag. The NAACP may have overlooked a lot of things, but they are not ones who want to be associated with a fake rape accusation. They remember Tawana Brawley, trust me.

The two charges will be dropped february 5th.

And by the way, weren't you the one who said with such certainty there was no way in hell the rape charge would be dropped/the accuser wouldn't go through with the rape charge? Suddenly her cousin Jakki is saying she wanted to drop ALL the charges twice and Nifong "wouldn't let her".

You wanna talk about dreamland? You want these boys to go to jail for no other reason than they are white and rich. in your own words...'keep dreaming'.

Anonymous said...

To: 5:44 are an ignorant fool who doesn't know the law. The false accuser is now a WITNESS for the state of NC. It is NC that has indicted the Defendants, based, as is clear to all, false testimony by the sole complaining witness. This witness, your "victim", together with Nifong, have violated the Defendants' rights. It is the Defendants' rights that the constitution protects,and against the very treachery that the state and your lying "victim" have tried to perpetrate. You think your victim has a soul? Let's see, third child on the way with 3 different fathers,and doesn't raise any of them; has DNA of 5 different males plus her boyfriend in and on her body, plus complained that Kim stole her $2,000. Remember? Not a bad haul for a weekend's work. Tax-free too. So, she's not poor. She is simply an irresponsible liar with questionable moral values, who is willing to bring children into this world knowing that neither she nor the fathers will raise them. This liar has plenty of rights, but maybe the NAACP can start teaching her about responsibilities and virtues, especially the virtue of honesty.

justice58 said...


What proof do you have that "she" wanted to drop rape charges? If you didn't get it from her lips... it's hearsay. Sorry.. but you lose..aggggain. That BS won't work in court.

No No... haha there's the dreaming again if you think the rest of the charges will be dropped. It's like.. your understanding is zero. Do you attend Duke??? hmmmm

justice58 said...


What does her having 3 children have anything to do with whether or not a rape happened? I tell you, I'm scared of all your ignorance.

Yes, she has rights and the NAACP IS right there to defend them. Got that??

Now lets talk about "questionable moral values" concerning the dukies... Read & take your time!

1. They hired women to strip (talk about morals)
2. They lied about who the party was for
3. They lied about who they were
4. They were involved in encouraging underage drinking
5.Some were convicted of other crimes
6. They were warned by the coach/university to tone down their behavior
7. They had no respect for their neighbors
8. Some were seen urinating out of windows & urinating on lawn
9. Throwing trash in neighbors yard
10. A trial will expose other things..

Don't try that BS with me about questionable morals values...okay!

Anonymous said...

The NAACP each night says its prayers of thanks that so many blacks still think its okay to have multiple children out of wedlock, then don't raise them,then turn themselves into drug addled alcoholic prostitutes, and then to save their sorry worthless asses, will try to destroy 3 innocent white students. Without sorry fools like you and Crystal, the NAACP leadership would have to go out and look for real work.

Anonymous said...

Talk about fools!

Now who was it arrested & indicted for rape, sexual assault & kidnapping charges after having a stripper party. Do you know?

Anonymous said...

Justice 58: God knows you are bearing false witness against your neighbor.
God knows you have hate in your heart.
She had multiple male DNA in her mouth, vagina, rectum ,and underwear.
Nothing from the players.
You are bearing false witness.
God knows.

bill anderson said...

Gee, "Injustice," how many drive-by shootings did the lacrosse players commit? How many armed robberies? For that matter, how many rapes?

So, please, do not try to tell me that the lacrosse players somehow were participants in a crime wave. Are they part of gangs? You in Durham know all about gangs, don't you?

No, we don't have to buy your crap any longer. The Durham street knew immediately that Crystal was lying, as did the cops, but the black community in Durham believed that it was entitled to being able to railroad people for crimes not committed.

Guess what, injustice? People rose up and now Nifong is in real trouble. I got an email tonight from a U.S. attorney who told me that Nifong has criminal liability.

Yes, "injustice," the black community helped to create a crime wave in Durham -- in the DA's office!

Don't give us this tired crap any longer. You know and I know that Reade, Collin, and Dave are not going to jail. Sorry to disappoint you, but the other charges will fall by the wayside, too, including your beloved Mikey Liefong.

You like lies?!? Drink up!! Indeed, drink up to all the lies that Crystal and the NAACP have told. Yes, the NAACP wants us to believe that Reade Seligmann came back to the party after going to the ATM in order to rape dear Crystal.

Oh, I am so sorry. Now, we find she was not raped. So sorry.

So, it is not about Crystal "being heard." It is about lying. It is about framing an African immigrant in order to impeach his testimony. Tell me, do you want Mikey Liefong to arrest the ATM, too?

You really make me sick, but the difference is that after this is over, you will still be a pathetic liar. The people you so hate, however, will be just fine.

justice58 said...

Ugh Bill

It's okay to dream! Everybody has a dream. But, some do come back to reality though. You just can't find your way back. Ohhh... so sad!

An e-mail from a U.S. attorney?????
Oh God NOOOOOOOOO....Say it ain't so!

Anonymous said...

Hey Justice, if you wanna talk moral behavior, how about performing sexual acts for money? How about stealing a taxi and trying to kill/run over a police officer? How about lying about rape? Inserting inanimate objects into her vagina for two complete strangers to get off. Funny, you condemn the guys for hiring a stripper (which is perfectly legal) but you don't condone her for BEING a stripper. She is a slut whore who has had 3 children out of wedlock, 2 who were the result of ADULTERY, she is a prescription drug abuser, an absent mother, a terrible daughter, and you have the balls to say public urination and underage drinking equate to anything this lying smut has done in her lifetime?

She has made a mockery of the African American community. So has Liefong. Do you not comprehend the seriousness of what he is accused of doing? he is a lawyer who abused his position and lied under oath un a court of law and railroaded three young men in order to "win" a case.

Crystal Mangum and Mike Nifong are going to share a jail cell together. The only "shows" she'll be doing are for him in their cell.

Anonymous said...

Oh and PS-I like that you overlooked my question. Weren't you the one who was DEFINITELY SURE the rape charge would NEVER be dropped? How come you were wrong?

You thought you were so right about the rape charge never being dropped, and you were 100% wrong, just like you are about the other charges being dropped. Nifong has no case whatsoever, Mangum is a lying slut and I can't WAIT for her to be exposed.

At the end of the day, Collin, Reade and Dave will continue with their lives, educate from an amazing school, get a good job, get married, raise and provide for a family. They will have good lives. Crystal, if she isnt in jail, will continue to get knocked up, overdose on prescription drugs, and fuck strange men for money.

Sucks for her.

Anonymous said...

Clarification: I didn't mean to imply that a different editor was at the helm when this broke. What I was saying was that the natural instincts of The Herald-Sun for years was to not be swayed by political correctness on any story. That was their strength. And when this story broke they reacted on that old instinct BEFORE being reined in by the Paducah mafia that bought the paper in 2005.

bill anderson said...

Yes, injustice, a U.S. attorney. That is, a federal prosecutor, and I got the sense that there are few roadblocks left for the investigation. You see, because blacks all vote for Democrats anyway, the Republican-run federal prosecutors do not have to worry about offending the blacks. They offend them just by being Republicans.

By the way, how many times did you and your friends laugh at the prospect of some white boys being falsely accused of rape? You see, injustice, I have my sources in Durham and they tell me that the blacks all knew it was a fraud, but they all relished the idea of false accusations and convictions.

Yes, injustice, you are a person without a conscience, just like Crystal. I suspect that you, too, would levy false charges against someone. But, in the end, you are just another liar, just like your friend Crystal.

You were swaggering around after the November election, weren't you? It was all a joke, Nifong gets wrongful convictions, and you and your friends high-five each other. Sorry that the story ends differently.

And don't give me the crap that Crystal was raped or that anyone even touched her. You and your friends already knew that, but you decided to perpetuate the lie anyway. Why? Because you are a dishonest person.

But, at least you spell better than Houston Baker.

justice58 said...

anon 8:43

The rape charges were dropped b/c the victim said ..she couldn't testify with certainty that a penis entered her. She most likely was under the influence of something that may have been given to her at the party. I can understand her NOT knowing whether a penis entered into her. That can be difficult sometimes if you're bent over and can't see what is going on. I don't fault her for that. It could have been any object such as dildo etc.

To my understanding: she NEVER NEVER NEVER said a rape DIDN'T happen. But as you know...the sexual assault and kidnapping charges still stand. Mike Nifong could have easily dropped ALL charges but he didn't. He knows something you & I don't.

Do you honestly think the defense is going to release some incriminating facts about the accused to the public? Be for real..pleassssse. I'm supporting her and I make NO apologies for it.
The victim has NOT been treated fairly because she dared to bring charges against rich duke students. This is why the NAACP stepped in to be a watch dog over this case & rightly so.

Read this & weep: This will go to trial and we will hear BOTH sides of the story, then a jury will render a fair verdict. Got that!

justice58 said...

Ugh Bill

"Yes, injustice, a U.S. attorney. That is, a federal prosecutor".

Are you a backwoods hillbilly or what?? Or is that just your ignorance showing? ("That is, a federal prosecutor").... woooo... I'm so d*** scared.

Bring on the federal prosecutor...he just might find something you don't like. Hell.. he might uncover a whole lot of hidden secrets. Bring him on!

bill anderson said...

This is not going to trial. By the way, injustice, they tested dear Crystal for the dreaded "date rape" drugs. No druggies were found. There was no "clear liquid." Crystal showed up drunk and drugged. She had plenty of help before she arrived. You cannot repeat the tired old lie because I am on to you.

You see, you can try to lie to others, but you cannot lie to me because I know this case. Furthermore, it never will make it to a jury no matter how much you want it to do so.

Nifong has no secret cache of information, and you know it. He got caught with his hand in the cookie jar and then decided to drop some charges after having declared all along he was certain that a rape had happened.

Oh, yes, injustice. During the ID video, your friend Crystal is pointing out the people, and then saying right out that he did so and so. But now, we are supposed to believe that he did NOT do so and so? Such crap, such crap.

You see, you are a liar, just like your friend, and just like the people at the NAACP. You must have read the Scottsboro Boys story, since you are sounding like the white racist prosecutors who went after the case. I recently wrote an article that drew the parallels.

Just think. After all these years of denouncing white racists, you basically decided to act like them. What a giant step forward, wouldn't you say?

Guess what, injustice. Your lies will not get this to trial. Sorry. Game over. And it will get even worse for Mikey Nifong, your hero.

justice58 said...


HAHAHA.. My God.. you're wrong agggain. You just don't get it! So sorry your understanding is "0".

The Judicial system will run it course & the only thing you can do is write on a blog, thinking you're accomplishing something and wish this case disappear.You're just pitiful and down right shameful.

I usually don't like to rub egg in anyone's face...but I can't help myself on this one. Stand up and take the egg like a man...okay!



Anonymous said...

heeheehee looks like Justice58 smacked your ass, bill. now that was funny.

bill anderson said...

Whatever. Writing in all caps does not change the fact that she is lying, and her friend Crystal is lying.

All of the writing in all caps, and all of the references to Almighty God won't change anything. Anyway, I am not sure that her little rant had anything to do with reality.

The case will disappear, but Durham's liability will not. Nor will Duke's. All of the bluster and wolfing that comes from injustice will not change the fact that the Duke Non-Rape Case will soon be the Duke Non-Rape, Non-Kidnapping, Non-Sexual Assault Case.

You see, the Holy Scriptures contains this little, bitty commandment that says, "You shall not bear false witness against your neighbors." False witness means lying. injustice knows a lot about lying.

Anonymous said...

Justice, is it going to be the same egg on our faces you said we'd have when the woman stood up on the stand and pointed out the three men and said "those are the boys that RAPED ME"? Or the egg you said we'd have on our faces when the 3 boys were found guilty of RAPE? Because as far as I can tell, we never got those eggs.

She gave a DETAILED explaination of a penis being in her. She explained in great detail what each boy did to her, and it included, in great detail, a penis. You think suddenly, 9 months later, she was like "umm actually, that wasn't a penis". Come on. It's a joke. Her and Nifong are in boiling water and it's only getting hotter.

Can't wait 'til it's dismissed, civil suits follow, and Liefong is disbarred.

Guy Fox said...

Justice58, I believe you made a Freudian slip when you said "The NAACP will work to defend injustice anywhere." While I don't believe that to be necessarily true in all, or even most, circumstances, they're certainly defending the perpetrators of a gross injustice in this case, and I've noticed how silent they're becoming. All I can figure is that you still believe Tawana Bradley as well. How does it feel, Justice58, to be on the side of the white supremacists during the Scottsboro Boys and Trenton Six trials? How does it feel to take the stance of the first two juries who tried Byron de la Beckwith after he murdered Medgar Evers? Those who fail to learn from history are damned to repeat it, and that's certainly some history that doesn't bear repeating.

Anonymous said...

Justice58---read to kill a mocking bird.

you might learn what all 9th graders learn--basing guilt and innocence on skin color is a horrid thing.

You are equivilant to the KKK--you seek "justice" for only those who share the pigment of your skin. How sad.

allie said...

justice, telling someone they're wrong and calling them ignorant without refuting a single one of their arguments isn't going to win you a debate against actual adults. please stop wasting our time.

Anonymous said...

Justice, you reall think the accuser said "i can not testify with certainty whether or not a penis was used to penetrate me"? Yeah, I'm sure those were her EXACT words. Just like the rape nurse in training said "there are inuuries consistant with rape"--we all know a.) she didn't say that (because the injuries WEREN'T consistant with rape and b.) that is legal jargen that lawyers used, which Mike NIfong LIED about.

This woman didn't say "i cnanot testify with certainty...etc", one, because there are just too many big words for someone like her to know (snicker), and two, that's not how people speak on a regular basis, let alone a stirpper with little education and a clearly limited sense of intelligence. She probably told Nifong she didn't want to go through with the rape charges anymore and that's how he phrased it in the court document.

You buy everything Nifong tells you. He could tell you black people have smaller brains and piss alcohol and you'd probably find a way to believe him. You're retarded, I hope you don't have kids, only adds to the already overwhelming stupidity in the world.

You should change your name to injustice59, or "im a race pandering idiot 38". Sounds good to me.

Hey, why don't you try TYPING IN ALL CAPS AGAIN because that made your point seem way more educated and your opinion way more credible. You sounded so smart. It's amazing WHAT CAPS CAN DO RIGHT? NOW I REALLY LISTEN TO PEOPLE WHO TYPE IN BIG LETTERS BECAUSE CLEARLY THOSE WHO TYPE IN CAPS REALLY ARE TELLING THE TRUTH AND WAY MORE INFORMED THAN ME. Do it again, please?

justice58 said...

anon 1:14

Your comment said: "Justice58---read to kill a mocking bird"

Been there- done that- next please!

justice58 said...


And you learned something!!! I'm shaking my head in dismay! Pleasssssssssse- next!

Chicago said...

Excellent piece!

Anonymous said...

i have to speak up:

1.Bill anderson you are nothing but a racist liar. The black people in Durham DO NOT believe in perpetuating a false case; they are like Justice in that many think something happened and the case is therefore not false at all and they believe the Dukies are liars and that they are buying justice. The blacks support a trial so the truth can finally come out. Therefore your statement that ALL the blacks in durham know the charges are a hoax and are going along with the railroading of 3 innocent men, etc is a LIE; especially since you have not had your racist ass in Durham period, much less talk to anybody black here. Like,Justice who was quoting scripture on here, many blacks in Durham are deeply religious and would not support bearing false witness againist their neighbor as it is a violation of one of the TEN Commandments.

Although this is hard for you to understand as you have spent a lot of time minimising the LAX team's bad behavior, many people point to the same things Justice has said in how the team set up the party, how they ran away afterward and their history of disciplinary problems at Duke and with DPD and the context of racial epithets as part of the belief that the LAX team did something to the accuser that night. MANY BLACKS DO NOT BELIEVE THE DUKE 3 ARE INNOCENT--THEY ARE NOT KNOWINGLY PROMOTING A RAILROAD, BILL ANDERSON!

2.You state that the LAX team has no history of rape but that is not true as the house at 610 Buchanon is well known on Duke campus as a site of date rape and has been toilet papered by irate coeds many times. Ask some current Duke undergrads and they can definitely corroborate the toilet papering and bad reputation on campus. It is also why the female LAX team was not there partying with these men that night as those girls knew better than to be there with them. The last police call to 610 Buchanon prior to the rape incident was a call about a naked white female coming out of a window at this house and running to campus and this was reported by the neighbors in Trinity Park; kind of chilling that they may have also done something abusive to white girls in the past. Nifong also mentioned he had recieved letters from women raped at Duke who had not come forward and i believe that some of the letters may refer to the antics at 610 buchanon. That may be what is keeping Nifong in this fight; the knowledge that the LAX team may have raped/assaulted before but the white victims were afraid to come forward.

bill anderson said...

Until now, I would have thought that most blacks in Durham would have believed Darryl Hunt was innocent. You see, when investigators finally did DNA testing, they DID NOT FIND Hunt's DNA on or in the body of Debra Lynn Sykes.

The LACK of DNA was enough not only to have Mr. Hunt freed, but also to win a pardon from the governor. The state NAACP supported Hunt's releast and the pardon.

Fast forward to 2006. Absolutely NO DNA was found on the accuser anywhere, but we suddenly heard that DNA did not matter in rape and assault cases. The NAACP told us that it did not matter, that only personal testimony mattered. Since Crystal had made an accusation, that was ALL that was needed to make the story true.

If one compares the evidence, we can see now that the NAACP's decision to back Hunt could only have been race-based, and not evidence-based. Why do I say that? Because in the Duke case, the NAACP suddenly is telling us that DNA is irrelevant, so if DNA is irrelevant here, then it would have to be irrelevant everywhere else, too.

Yes, you can call me a racist if you like. It's a lie, but people have been telling so many lies, beginning with Crystal, that one more really will not be noticed.

bill anderson said...

Let me make one correction. Absolutely NO DNA from any lacrosse player was found on Crystal. There was lots of DNA from other men.

By the way, she told police she had not engaged in sexual relations with anyone else for a week. Guess the DNA must have come from thin air, as all of us know that Crystal does not lie.

Anonymous said...


Do you have ANY PROOF whatsoever that the Duke Lacrosse team was ever accused of a date rape? Because as far as I know (and, being a female lacrosse manager, I think I'd know) no one on that team has ever been accused of date raping a woman, let alone at 610 Buchanan. So I don't know who you are talking to on the Duke campus, but no one on that team has ever been accused of date raping, or raping in general for that matter, a woman. Ever.

But please, continue to perpetrate MORE lies, make up more BS just so you have an excuse to hate the rich white kids. Why don't you make up the lie that they put puppies in the oven so you have yet another excuse to hate them?

As for the blacks in Durham, you making the excuse that they "really believe something happened" makes it worse. It shows that blacks in Durham WANT to believe something happened so incredibly badly, that they are willing to look over every piece of evidence that has nothing to do with race-DNA, paper trails, eye witness testimony, time lines created by the DA himself, faulty IDing processes, descriptions that match NONE of the indicted, and the list goes on. If black people can overlook ALL of this evidence and the DA's blatent lying, it proves that either a.) they really are stupid and don't deserve any human rights because they don't know how to use them properly, or b.) they want so desperately to see a white kid get in trouble for "harming" a black woman, that they will ignore all evidence that is pure fact, and rely entirely on an accuser's testimony that not only has been faulty, but changed multiple times, with very limited credibility. If this case were reversed, and several young black men were on the chopping block, do you think the black community would be so quick to dismiss ALL the exculpatory evidence on the word of a white woman? I sincerely doubt it.

Let me give you an example of why your reasoning of "the judiciary process must got through" and "there must be a trial"....You are in Durham right now (or so I assume)...I am in New York. I call 911 at this very moment (9:25 in the morning) and tell them you (I have your name, for argument's sake) raped me, violently. The police show up to your house in Durham and arrest you. I give the polie several versions of a story that involves you and me and a rape. You not only weren't even in New York at the time I say I was raped, you can prove you were somewhere else. No where on or in my body is any DNA from you, but there is DNA from several other men, even though I swore under oath that I had not had sex with anyone for at least a week. I have no signs of rape, no phsyical signs of rape, and even in the first hours of the accusation, you provide tons of evidence that proves you weren't there. But I still say you raped me.

Do I deserve to take you to trial? Would you feel that I had a right to put your entire life on hold for 9 months, make you pay for a lawyer, pay for bail, and run your good name through the mud if you knew, the public knew, and both of our lawyers knew that not only is there no way in hell I will get a conviction, but that you are absolutely innocent? Would you be willing to watch your life get torn to shreds simply because I felt like accusing you? Do you think I deserve the "judiciary" right to simply ruin your life with absolutely no facts or evidence to support my accusation?

No. I can guarantee you would not sit idly back and say "Yes Stef, please, let the judiciary process continue on it's way, I have nothing better to do for 9 months, I don't mind that I lost my job (like Evans) and that I can't attend my classes (Dave and Reade). I don't mind that even when I am proven innocent the rape charges will follow me for the rest of my life, I don't mind that every single person in the nation knows every detail about my family, where I live, how much my parents make, my GPA, what classes I took last fall, fights I've gotten into, phone calls I've made. I don't mind having racist groups, like the Black Panther Party, showing up where I live screaming racist, inciting riots in the courtroom by using racial epitephts, threatening my life. I don't care, I think it is imperative that you get the trial because it is your right as a human to have your say.

Is that what you'd say? I hope so. Because if it's not, you have no right whatsoever to say "people in durham believe a trial is NECCESSARY". A trial is only neccessary when there is evidence to cooberate an accusation. I can't just have David Ortiz arrested for rape and taken to a lengthy and expensive trial without any proof whatsoever. That's not how the courts system work in America, and for a very good reason. If we could just "go to trial" without any proof whatsoever, we could accuse and theoretically charge anyone with any crime at any time and our taxes would be a WHOLLLLLLE lot higher for all the unneccessary court proceedings.

And I hate how everyone says the white boys are "buying" justice. What, because they are able to pay for capable attorney's who did their jobs (sought and provided exculpatory evidence for their client) suddenly it's a scam? It isn't real? Did you expect wealthy families who care deeply about their children to let some no name 50$ lawyer represent their sons in a case that may put their sons in jail based on race alone for 30+ years? Did you expect the parents and families of these young men to not do everything within their legal power to protect their sons and make sure they were well represented? No one is paying anyone off here to get the boys off. No one is covering anything up (with exception to Mike Liefong) to get the boys off. No one is fucking around with the case to get the boys off. The boys own innocence is what is making it so easy for their lawyers to get them off. If it had anything to do with money or "buying" justice, the entire case would have been dropped months ago. Seeing as it wasn't, I don't think the boys have "bought" their way out of anything. Just because their families have money doesn't mean the families (and the guys) aren't capable of doing the right thing. No where does it say that money = bad doings. My family is affluent and I grew up with Collin. I have lived a good and moral life. I once stole something from the Discovery Zone when I was 7 and I sat in my room crying about it, then returned it. My paren'ts money had nothing to do with my upbrining in terms of any trouble I've ever gotten into or out of.

As for you Justice--if you claim to have read TKaMB, clearly you failed the test on it, because you learned nothing from the book. I suggest you reread it and take into account its message about race, race baiting, race pandering, and false accusations based on race. Something tells me your simple mind can't grasp the bigger concept though.

Anonymous said...

4:33 has tried to spin the date rape lies before on this and other blogs. he/she has never backed them up. they are false, just like Mikey's case and Crystal's story.

allie said...

so.. given a choice between knowingly perpetuating a false case and being too stupid/stubborn to actually realize that the case is false, you think most durhamites fall into the latter category.

eh, I guess ignorance is preferable to malice, right?

I did enjoy your toilet-papering story though, because that's totally what I would do if I got raped- go TP the guy's house.

Guy Fox said...

Justice58, while I defend your right to spread your garbage, you are woefully pathetic and lack the debate skills of an infant barely out of its diapers. When mountains of evidence comes to light of the Duke 3's actual innocence and an even greater flood of proof of prosecutorial misconduct on the part of Nifong, you choose to believe that the facts are mentioned because those who support them, regardless of their race, hate African-Americans. As a side note, I think the term "African-American" is complete and utter bullshit, because Dr. King wanted this to be one America and most people in this nation have never even been to Africa, and even fewer are from there.

4:33, the only thing your comments have in common with justice is that the word "justice" was used. However, your understanding of the meaning of the word is nonexistent. Since you seem handicapped in this area, I'll give you a dumbed-down definition of "justice". Justice is what happens when innocent people are set free, when their names are not dragged through the mud over the course of the better part of a year without cause, and when their civil rights aren't grossly violated by a rogue prosecutor whose sole interest is the pursuit of his career instead of the pursuit of justice. Perhaps you can answer me a question, though: How does it feel now that you know that one "man," one Mr. Nifong, has made you and thousands of eager patsies his bitch?

Anonymous said...

Justice58, by your logic and utter disregard for empirical, scientific evidence what do the facts have to do with anything? You are same idiot who would prefer they teach creationism rather than evolution. This case is over. The only issue to be determined here is how much who will be paying those 3 wrongly accused and when they will pay it. This is how it will shake out.

Anonymous said...
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